General Forums >> Training Concepts & Tactics >> Knee Wall Fires
Knee Wall Fires
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Posted 4 months ago On July 14, 2008, 9 members of my platoon were caught in what can be called a "Backdraft" I suppose. The explosion occured as a hose line was opened into a third story knee wall, that contained extension of a fire located above a second floor closet light fixture. Thank the Creator that no one was hurt, and an Emergency Evacuation was executed "Real World." My question is "What are the initial considerations for these hidden fires, that appear to have ventilation obstacles, and discovery delays?" Our Captain thought things were in hand, and even came out for a bottle exchange. I was the pump operator, and was concerned when no water was flowing for nearly 20 minutes. What a terrible feeling to watch the roof blow off! Any input appreciated. We have dozens of these structures in town. Very Thankful...
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| Posted 4 months ago Just a few quick questions before I answer your questions. Do you guys have a TIC? If so, do you have SOP's for using it at all fires to search for hidden fire? Im guessing that when you mentioned opening up the line on the wall, that it opened the sheetrock and caused the rapid introduction of air which caused the Backdraft, right? Were any of your guys hurt? Hope all is well, let me know about my questions and stay safe. Moose Brian "Moose" Jones
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| Posted 4 months ago We do have a TIC, and it should have gone in with the first crew, but didn't. (Policy reviewed in critique) The knee wall had a small door, and the fire was observed, and the door closed for containment. During this time, the 200 ft 1 3/4" had to be extended to reach the attic, and the crew came out for a bottle swap. The crew returned, and the extended line was opened up at the knee wall door, then boom! Noone was hurt, two guys were at the seat, 7 others in the adjoining kitchen/apartment, and down the stairwell, all got their bells rung. We all got a wake up call.
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| Posted 4 months ago Just off the hip here, and only hearing the info you shared...Stronger SOP's pertaining to TIC usage at every fire and stronger training in Building Construction. Every firefighter should have an extensive knowledge about building construction....so much info can be gained from this knowledge on factors pertaining to fire behavior and fire spread, avenues the fire will travel and hide, how fast it could travel...Training is the key brother. Train in Building Construction and use of the TIC...make that tool a permanent attachment to the officers/back up mans hand!!! LOL The Initial Attack crew should always have one, and it should always be in the building with every crew. Thats the best I can offer to you and everyone else reading this. I am glad that no one was hurt and all are ok, and I wish you guys luck in taking care of this situation. Stay Safe Brother Moose Brian "Moose" Jones
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| Posted 4 months ago Thanks for the advice. We are continuing to review this incident, and will have more information available at a later time. I will make sure the TIC never stays on the rig again. |
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| Posted 2 months ago Why wasn't there a vent crew on the roof? The explosion could have been prevented with proper vertical ventilation. Every piece of equipment carries a TIC here, and it is more often utilized by truck companies searching for extension above the attack team as the group moves forward. |
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| Posted about 1 month ago I agree with the building construction knowledge as well as the TIC SOG's. One thing that I would like to add.. as aggressive as we are with interior attack we need to be just as aggressive at Salvage and overhaul operations. Doesn't matter if they are being done by the truck or the engine hidden fires kill us. Get into the overhaul phase early. Never let your guard down! IF we open up those walls in a sense we are ventilating...sort of. Remember it is easy to "armchair quarterback" be careful. |